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Bad Bunny and Open Thread

Bad Bunny, who is finishing up a two month residency in Puerto Rico where he sold out 30 shows, is about to embark on a world tour of Latin America, Europe, Asia and Oceania. He excluded concerts in the U.S. on the tour, as he explains, because of ICE raids. He explains inin a recent interview: [More...]

[Interviewer]You said you wouldn’t be giving any concerts in the United States. Was this out of concern about [the mass deportations of Latinos in the United States?

[BB]Man, honestly, yes. There were many reasons why I didn’t show up in the US, and none of them were out of hate—I’ve performed there many times. All of [the shows] have been successful. All of them have been magnificent. I’ve enjoyed connecting with Latinos who have been living in the US.

But specifically, for a residency here in Puerto Rico, when we are an unincorporated territory of the US… People from the US could come here to see the show. Latinos and Puerto Ricans of the United States could also travel here, or to any part of the world. But there was the issue of—like, f!cking ICE could be outside [my concert]. And it’s something that we were talking about and very concerned about.

This is an open thread, all topics welcome. If you want to discuss Charlie Kirk, no insults to him or his politics please. First, Talkleft has a policy of not speaking ill of people on the occasion of their death. Second, multiple news sites are reporting on the radical right's doxxing of all who criticize him, including publishers of websites and podcasts where derogatory comments appear. This is something I don't need in my life.

There are plenty of other newsworthy and other topics to discuss, from Hamas and Qatar to the New York Fashion Show to our favorite TV shows. I'm watching a lot of K-Pop these days. Netflix has "Beyond the Bar" and lots of new "Love is Blind" seasons. The 9th season of LIB is entirely filmed in Denver and starts October 1. I think Netflix's international limited crime series are better than those filmed in the U.S. -- they don't always take the side of law enforcement. If you'd like some recommendations, let me know in comments and I'll add them there.

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  • Display: Sort:
    Downton Abbey... (5.00 / 2) (#1)
    by desertswine on Fri Sep 12, 2025 at 10:59:05 PM EST
    We went to see Downton Abbey tonight.  There were only old people there.  The movie was so stupid that I liked it.  Nothing is so liberating as the fake made-up problems of silly people in a crappy movie.  It's just maudlin escapism, but what I needed.

    I don't recommend it.  It's only for the true die-hard fans of the TV series.

    We saw "Highest2Lowest" last night (5.00 / 1) (#9)
    by Peter G on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 02:12:19 PM EST
    the new Spike Lee film with Denzel Washington, remaking a Kurosawa film of the 1960s. Despite some odd holes in the plot, we enjoyed it a lot. Fun, exciting, interesting characterizations, and excellent acting. Big views of NYC make it good to see in a theater.

    Parent
    The third season of Foundation was really good. (none / 0) (#3)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 10:25:38 AM EST
    It's been renewed for 4.  Dexter Resurrection is also great.  

    Parent
    It really is (none / 0) (#39)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 05:09:53 PM EST
    This is where we are, he keeps his job. (5.00 / 1) (#77)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 11:01:34 AM EST
    Fox News Host Apologizes for Call to Kill Homeless People
    September 14, 2025 at 11:21 am EDT By Taegan Goddard 58 Comments

    Fox News host Brian Kilmeade apologized for his call to murder mentally ill homeless people: "I wrongly said they should get lethal injections. I apologize for that extremely callous remark."

    Howdy, here is brilliant video (5.00 / 1) (#82)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 11:46:56 AM EST
    Explaining the online subcultures and the subculturism we are seeing and experiencing in this moment.

    Video

    Parent

    Of course (none / 0) (#80)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 11:22:50 AM EST
    And the Republican Gov of Utah claims some kid in rural Utah is transitioning. Transitioning how? Growing his hair out for a banana clip? Is he taking his sister's birth control pills?

    Parent
    Apart from anything else (none / 0) (#81)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 11:44:10 AM EST
    I'm pretty sure a kid from rural Utah could be transitioning.

    Parent
    It doesn't matter as far as whether Tyler's (5.00 / 1) (#83)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 12:34:40 PM EST
    Actions can be due to his right-wing affiliations. You can absolutely be a right-wing Nick Fuentes follower that might also be in an alternative gender relationship. Groypers aren't traditional right-wing people as we understand that.

    I have two trans individuals in my life in this age group right now. Transitioning as it is defined for them is very ambiguous.  It doesn't involve permanent physical changes but it can. Transitioning can just be altering appearances and pronouns. One moves back and forth because parents are against it. And it throws me off somedays because two different names are involved.

    Parent

    What doest matter (none / 0) (#93)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 02:55:57 PM EST
    is where you live.  I promise you thee are rural people going through the same thing as the people in your life.  
    And they are probably doing it with no support from family.

    I am a progressive gay man who does not own a gun.
    Every single local family member is a rabid Trump supporter and they jointly own an arsenal.  
    I have to tell you this

    And the Republican Gov of Utah claims some kid in rural Utah is transitioning. Transitioning how? Growing his hair out for a banana clip? Is he taking his sister's birth control pills?

    Is a strange comment.  Gay people and trans people don't just exist where it's convenient and urban or rural they deserve compassion and I can believe I need to say that.


    Parent

    Shutdown (none / 0) (#4)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 10:28:04 AM EST
    Democrats Name Their Price for Avoiding Shutdown
    September 13, 2025 at 6:57 am EDT By Taegan Goddard 168 Comments

    "The next federal-funding deadline is just weeks away. Democrats say restoring billions of dollars in health-insurance subsidies for Americans is the minimum price of their vote, holding the threat of a shutdown over Republicans' heads," the Wall Street Journal reports.

    "Democrats are more confident in their negotiating stance compared with March, when a similar attempt to play hardball fizzled. While today's talks pit them against Republican leaders who want a two-month spending deal with no big additions, they are finding support among rank-and-file GOP lawmakers fearing political backlash if their voters are hit by higher health-insurance bills next year."

    You know (none / 0) (#6)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 12:19:53 PM EST
    I almost wish they would let people's insurance prices rise so voters could see the full effects of voting Republican. The flip side is that too many people won't be able to afford insurance and it seems we always are called to be the bigger people.

    Parent
    Well, I've reached a point in my life ... (none / 0) (#94)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 02:57:52 PM EST
    "Shanna, they bought their tickets, they knew what they were getting into. I say, let 'em crash."
    - Jack Kirkpatrick (William Tregoe), "Airplane!" (1980)

    ... where I'm perfectly fine with letting voters reap and rue the consequences of their own perpetually mediocre political choices. I'm tired of always being the adult in a room full of people who tend to resent that.

    So, I say, let 'em crash. Maybe then, they'll finally learn.

    Parent

    If Democrats can force (none / 0) (#95)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:04:00 PM EST
    some movement they should absolutely do it.  It would be nice to see them suffer if it was just them.

    Parent
    What I find (none / 0) (#98)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:17:58 PM EST
    ironic is maga thinks they can just make liberals suffer from their policies but we understand everybody suffers.

    Parent
    Based on my own social media feeds (none / 0) (#7)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 02:09:12 PM EST
    I would say they have their work cut out for them.

    This (none / 0) (#8)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 02:11:20 PM EST
    Not good (none / 0) (#10)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 02:33:08 PM EST
    Shooter Apparently Had a Transgender Partner
    September 13, 2025 at 3:10 pm EDT By Taegan Goddard 68 Comments

    Accused Charlie Kirk assassin Tyler Robinson lived with his transgender partner, Fox News reports.

    The individual, who is a male transitioning to a female, is fully cooperating with the FBI.

    I thought (none / 0) (#14)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 02:55:31 PM EST
    he lived at home with his parents?

    Either way if that is true I expect terrible violence from maga.

    Parent

    Nope (none / 0) (#17)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:01:25 PM EST
    lived in a house

    A pretty nice one

    Parent

    Some (5.00 / 1) (#22)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:18:26 PM EST
    are saying that's his parent's house. And they are also saying he has a roommate that he interacted with not a girlfriend/boyfriend. Sounded like someone he met while in college and roomed with but not in a relationship with.

    Parent
    If he killed him for his friend (none / 0) (#28)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:36:00 PM EST
    and not his lover that's even better.

    Parent
    Yeah (none / 0) (#31)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:42:08 PM EST
    but won't stop the violence.

    If you haven't you should listen to the governor of Utah. These days it is so strange to hear a NORMAL person say the usual things. I never thought I would miss that kind of thing.

    Parent

    Governor Cox's (5.00 / 2) (#51)
    by KeysDan on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 06:43:02 PM EST
    letter to the Utah House and Senate explaining his veto of the bill in 2022 to ban trans athletes from participating in girls sports was remarkable.

    A key except: "..... there is one more important reason for this veto. I must admit, I am not an expert on transgenderism. I struggle to understand so much of it and the science is conflicting. When in doubt, however, I always try to err on the side of kindness, mercy and compassion. I also try to get proximate and I am learning so much from our trans community.  They are great kids who face enormous struggles. "

    "... 75, 000 high school kids in high school sports, one transgender student playing girls sports, four trans students playing high school sports. 86 percent of trans youth report suicidality, 56 percent of trans youth have attempted suicide".   "... rarely has so much fear and anger been directed at so few."

    The veto was overridden and the governor received severe criticism from his party, including a call from a deceased person in the news this past week who called for his expulsion from the Republican Party, according to reporting in The Guardian".

    Parent

    You don't know enough about Fuentes or groypers (none / 0) (#58)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 12:36:08 AM EST
    Fuentes suspected significant other is a furry called Catboy or something like that. They occasionally have photos together. What these guys say and how they may choose to live doesn't need to be congruent. It's weird, I know. All of the groyper memes are supposed to confuse normies.  Not be able to be understood by us because we aren't indoctrinated.

    Parent
    Of course (none / 0) (#20)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:06:16 PM EST
    this means more violence for trans people.  But it's kind of romantic.

    In a Straw Dogs kind of way.

    Can't think of a better reason.

    Parent

    Oh, I think (5.00 / 1) (#24)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:20:43 PM EST
    it means more than violence for just trans people. Steve Bannon is saying it's war so basically anybody who is not maga is a target.

    Parent
    Sorry (5.00 / 1) (#25)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:24:59 PM EST
    I mean a Dog Day Afternoon kind of way.  

    Confused my dog movies.

    Parent

    There is actually something a bit (none / 0) (#59)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 12:42:29 AM EST
    'Dog Day Afternoon' about the whole groyper cult.

    Parent
    Big Balls is a groyper (none / 0) (#60)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 12:42:58 AM EST
    It's (none / 0) (#12)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 02:49:38 PM EST
    True

    It's (none / 0) (#13)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 02:51:59 PM EST
    Try a google (none / 0) (#18)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:01:47 PM EST


    I did (none / 0) (#19)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:06:10 PM EST
    and the few articles I clicked on started with "The NY Post is reporting..." with no original sources and no mainstream sources.

    Parent
    The source is a Fox correspondent (none / 0) (#21)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:16:19 PM EST
    so I hope you are correct.  But I don't think Political Wire would be posting it if he didn't believe it.

    Parent
    The report says (none / 0) (#23)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:19:54 PM EST
    the FBI told her this.  It doesn't sound like something a normal FBI agent would discuss with a reporter

    Only a MAGA/FOX FBI agent.  Could still be true.

    Parent

    Yeah (none / 0) (#26)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:28:37 PM EST
    that does sound fishy. It also was sinking in that the guy was a groyper with maga. Need something to distract them and nothing works like a trans person.

    Parent
    Well it's either (none / 0) (#27)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:34:54 PM EST
    true or it isn't.  We should know fairly soon.

    Oddly I don't find it that had to believe.  It makes perfect sense.

    Parent

    It does (none / 0) (#34)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:51:03 PM EST
    and it doesn't. to me anyway.

    Seems like they would have a picture of the "trans girlfriend" in the article to back up what they are saying but there isn't one.

    Parent

    Unclear (none / 0) (#35)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:56:28 PM EST

    His identity was revealed as separate reports emerged from Fox and the New York Post which stated that Robinson was living with a 'transgender partner' who is co-operating with the investigation.

    It is unclear if Twiggs is the same person referenced in the reports and he has not been named in the affidavit. His grandfather, Jerry Twiggs, told Daily Mail that he was unable to comment on rumors that he is trans and that there was a transgender motive to Kirk's murder.

    'I don't want to comment on that. I'm not sure what his situation is exactly right now,' he said, adding that he had never met Robinson.

    Jerry also confirmed his grandson had been talking with the police, but that he had not spoken to him since.

    'After he was with the police, he's been at his house, and there's no way for us to contact him other than going over there,' he said.



    Parent
    The report (none / 0) (#49)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 06:32:43 PM EST
    I found said that the shooter had 3 roommates and yes there was one cooperating with the police. Same person you named. Only one picture with a hoodie which did not look "trans" only like a guy with a hoodie. You would think if they wanted to prove that point they could find a picture with a dress and makeup.

    Parent
    This (none / 0) (#50)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 06:42:47 PM EST
    Yes (none / 0) (#52)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 06:48:59 PM EST
    Just an observation (none / 0) (#53)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 06:57:23 PM EST
    You called that a hoodie.  It's really more like something a "Furrie" would wear.

    I believe some of the ammo messages referenced Furries?

    Parent

    This (none / 0) (#54)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 07:04:50 PM EST

    The message engraved on the casing of the bullet that killed Charlie Kirk is used in trolling and "furry" subculture -- and experts told The Post on Friday it was written by someone likely chronically online.

    The casing had the words, "Notices Buldge OWO what's this?" on it, according to an arrest affidavit targeting suspected assassin Tyler Robinson, a 22-year-old trade-school student from Utah.  

    The string of words can be used for trolling -- and connected to online furry and role-play groups, digital culture experts said.



    Parent
    TBH (none / 0) (#55)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 07:47:37 PM EST
    I really did not look that close. I just saw a brown hood. So is that a groyper thing? It sounds like a gamer thing to me.

    Parent
    Furries are not a gamer thing exactly (5.00 / 1) (#56)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 07:51:05 PM EST
    Furries are fans of anthropomorphic animals--animals with human characteristics--and the furry fandom is a diverse community united by this interest. While not everyone in the fandom creates a "fursona" (a personal furry character) or wears a "fursuit" (an animal costume), these are common ways for furries to express their creativity and embody these characters. The community is known for its diversity and acceptance, providing a social network and a sense of belonging for its members, much like other fandoms such as Star Trek or anime.  

    Adding for some there is an adult element.  If you know what I mean.

    Parent

    There are also furries not into the adult element (none / 0) (#61)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 01:07:26 AM EST
    There is also a sect of Nazi furries.

    I never thought there would be a need to discuss any of this lol.

    One of Josh's close friends through college and still, had a furry college side hustle. I will call her E. Of their crowd senior year, only Josh and E remained in college. A couple had graduated and a couple took the year off, Covid brought two to have to deal with depression. But Josh and E would hang, try to find things to do to keep them going. E needed some cash flow tho.  She's a good anime artist and furries will pay a decent anime artist to draw them as their furry doing "adult" furry things. Josh suggested to E that she advertise her services lol. And it turned out E excelled at this and had more college cash than you could shake a stick at. But it got rough for Josh lol. Both Josh and E were in philosophy classes with seminary students, and Josh really liked them and they liked Josh as well. But sometimes in the middle of philosophy class with all these future priests and class discussion and debate, E would be simultaneously cranking out her next piece of furry porn, and embarass the shit out of Josh lololol

    Parent

    It would help (none / 0) (#57)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 07:55:59 PM EST
    If we knew the the hoodie had paws.

    I did some shopping for Furry attire.  I didn't find that exact one.  

    Parent

    Furries have their outfits (none / 0) (#62)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 01:09:48 AM EST
    Custom made usually. If you're serious. You don't want to show up to the orgy and find out you're already there lol.

    Parent
    Furry (none / 0) (#70)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 08:21:05 AM EST
    That's just goofing around (none / 0) (#74)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 09:52:49 AM EST
    That is not you in your furriness. Their costumes are a whole deal. Think like what you have seen some people do and invest in their Renaissance Festival costume. Those hoodies are when you and I show up at the festival and buy the plastic Viking horns helmet.

    Parent
    Well (none / 0) (#29)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:39:54 PM EST
    I just checked the local news and there is nothing about a girlfriend/roommate or anything new.

    Local (none / 0) (#30)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:40:09 PM EST
    news in Utah that is.

    Parent
    It seems likely (none / 0) (#33)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 03:50:26 PM EST
    domestic news sources might be avoiding the subject for the very reasons you mention.

    It is explosive news.  


    Parent

    AXIOX (none / 0) (#71)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 08:31:25 AM EST
    Axios' sources said investigators initially wanted the information about the roommate's gender identity kept quiet because that person is being "extremely cooperative" with authorities.

    Parent
    GA (none / 0) (#37)
    by Jeralyn on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 04:14:11 PM EST
    I emphatically stated no comments with criticism or mocking of Kirk's politics or views would be allowed here. I've deleted at least six of your comments on this thread and the last one. This is a lot of work for me and I do not want your comments to result in TalkLeft being named on any list of websites to go after or dox. Please take this sh*t elsewhere. Do not mock Maga, Trump, his kids or the Kirks or his organization here. Howdy, do not respond to those comments as those will be deleted as well.

    The accused is different but stop bringing gossip here. Either cite a valid news source (not the Post or Fox News) or take it elsewhere.

    Thank you and I am quite serious about this. Do not use Talkleft as a dumping ground.

    Got it (none / 0) (#38)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 04:22:40 PM EST
    Are we really lending credence (none / 0) (#40)
    by jondee on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 05:39:08 PM EST
    to the 'reportage' of the same people who, not long ago, paid out an 800 mil libel settlement for peddling conspiratorial garbage for months?

    Parent
    No we are not (none / 0) (#41)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 05:53:15 PM EST
    we are pointing out it's being reported in a lot of places.  And they are not all based on the one x post.

    And if it's true it's seismic.  

    Parent

    In a lot of places (5.00 / 1) (#44)
    by jondee on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 06:08:06 PM EST
    but all originating from one source, as far as I've seen.

    Parent
    I think he is being charged (none / 0) (#42)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 05:58:15 PM EST
    on Tuesday.  I expect more info will be coming out then.

    Parent
    All I will (none / 0) (#43)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 06:06:55 PM EST
    say is I went down a rabbit hole on that one and it doesn't look credible. However I don't think it matters if it is true. Remember how Bush & Cheney used to feed false information to the press about Iraq and then go on the shows the next day and say the XXX reported XXXX?

    Parent
    You don't think it matters if it true (none / 0) (#45)
    by CaptHowdy on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 06:10:27 PM EST
    you were just saying how bad it would be.  

    I agree with the first idea.  

    Parent

    Yeah (none / 0) (#46)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 06:27:03 PM EST
    it will be bad. My point is really that people will just believe it so it won't matter if it's true. The goal is to get the lie out there and churn and churn and then by the time the truth comes out people have already accepted the lie and never hear the truth.

    Heather Cox Richardson was discussing this yesterday. A lot of people think the shooter was trans because that's what they heard first thing.

    Parent

    I also (none / 0) (#48)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 06:29:00 PM EST
    think this was put in the press because some bad Epstein stuff is going to come out this coming week.

    Parent
    I apologize (none / 0) (#47)
    by Ga6thDem on Sat Sep 13, 2025 at 06:28:05 PM EST
    Those of us who are old enough ... (none / 0) (#65)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 06:15:14 AM EST
    ... to remember Watergate will also remember that one month prior to the break-in and initial arrests, Gov. George Wallace (D-AL) was shot by 21-year-old would-be assassin Arthur Bremer while campaigning in Maryland for the Democratic presidential nomination. Bremer's vicious assault nearly killed him and rendered him a paraplegic.

    Much like Charlie Kirk, Wallace was a charismatic political populist and provocateur who had the capacity to rouse significant and intense passions amongst both his supporters and detractors, and there were times when he appeared to relish the angry divisions he had created and fostered.

    Still, regardless of where adults stood on the matter of George Wallace and his race-baiting populist appeals to white Southerners, I remember most people being sincerely shocked and dismayed by the assassination attempt against him.

    Obviously, nobody should be shot for holding noxious personal views or expressing them in public. But still, there was a discernable awkwardness amongst those who had truly despised Wallace, which included most members of my family in Southern California.

    It was a situation not unlike the one we're experiencing at present: How best does one lament the cruel fate of someone who is so intensely disliked and held in such contempt by so many? Rep. Shirley Chisolm (D-NY), a Black politician who like Wallace had embarked on a quixotic quest for the Democratic nomination that same year, responded by visiting Wallace while he was still in the hospital to express her condolences for his misfortune and wish him well.

    Because, like you, I find it distasteful to speak ill of the deceased on the occasion of their passing, I've decided to just shut up about Charlie Kirk. I'm under no illusions about who he was and what he stood for but still, I recognize that resorting to violence as a means to resolve a political or philosophical disagreement is the ultimate of selfish acts.

    Nearly ten years after Arthur Bremer left him confined to a wheelchair for life, and after some obvious and no doubt painful soul-searching, George Wallace embarked on an odyssey of personal contrition and redemption. He spoke to congregations of Black churches and members of civil rights organization across the entire state of Alabama and expressed what many who heard him felt to be a sincere and heartfelt mea culpa, taking personal responsibility for his own past hateful conduct and incendiary rhetoric and apologizing to everyone for having hurt so many in his earlier lifetime.

    Black voters responded by sweeping Wallace back into the governor's mansion in 1983, where he matched his words of contrition with actual deeds, making more African American political appointments to public office than any other figure in Alabama history, before or since.

    George Wallace proved that nobody should ever be dismissed as totally irredeemable, and that people can and do change their ways for the better, regardless of whether it's of their own volition or they were compelled by circumstances to do so.

    Personally, I am grieved that Charlie Kirk will never be afforded that opportunity to find his own more productive path forward, to learn from his mistakes or misfortune and grow positively from the experience. It's as much our loss as it is his own.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    The times are out of joint (none / 0) (#63)
    by jondee on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 02:15:46 AM EST
    as the bard said.

    Brian Kilmeade on Fox just said "or just kill them" - suggesting extrajudical murder as a way to solve the homelessness problem. Luckily, Brian's still alive, so I assume it's alright to draw attention to what he said.

    Aktion T4 (5.00 / 2) (#64)
    by jondee on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 02:59:35 AM EST
    is what the Germans called it. I don't know if Fox has a codename for it or not.

    Parent
    AXIOS (none / 0) (#66)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 07:37:13 AM EST
    Marc Caputo lol (none / 0) (#67)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 07:58:00 AM EST
    Who is utterly Trump's creature now. Armando rages about it.

    Parent
    So (none / 0) (#69)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 08:02:42 AM EST
    You don't believe it?

    Parent
    I think Caputo is toeing a line for MAGA (none / 0) (#72)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 09:40:32 AM EST
    And there is nothing "leftist" involved in  Kirk's demise. Believe me, if there was we would already know. I think Tyler was a groyper, and nothing more. I also think he was likely on the spectrum and it is just painful for these kids on the spectrum raised by MAGA parents. They 100% embrace the rules they are taught even when it conflicts drastically with their inner being.

    One of Josh's best friends since junior high committed suicide 2 yrs ago. He was on the spectrum and raised MAGA. I wept for 24 hrs. I didn't sleep at all the first night, just stared into the darkness and the tears wouldn't stop. I'll never get over losing him like that....to ALA effing BAMA

    Parent

    Well (none / 0) (#75)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 10:26:49 AM EST
    I think lots of things.  I think we should probably not decide what happened here until we know more.

    AFAIK Mark Caputo is an investigative reporter not that different from others.  He's worked for Republico (Politico) and AXIOS is a bunch of libertarians.

    That doesn't mean any of that reporting is not true.

    I would expect Caputos reporting to be picked by others.  He's a regular on MSNBC.

    Parent

    The Gov of Utah just confirmed (none / 0) (#76)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 10:46:50 AM EST
    Dude...Tyler's family owns (none / 0) (#79)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 11:19:17 AM EST
    A "ma duece" and photographs their kids with it. There are photos of Tyler with it. Do you know what someone has to go through to own a "ma duece" in the United States? Do you know how gun nuts you have to be? That's why Tyler had to get a scholarship. His dad spent his college funds on a "ma duece" and all that that entails lololol

    Parent
    Nothing like a fifty caliber (none / 0) (#85)
    by jondee on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 12:45:46 PM EST
    machine gun to bring the family together.


    Parent
    Costing about $36,000 dollars (5.00 / 1) (#88)
    by Peter G on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 02:12:50 PM EST
    if I am interpreting my quick Google search correctly. But I thought private ownership of fully automatic, military-style machine guns was prohibited in the U.S. by federal law. Am I missing something?

    Parent
    You have to jump through incredible hoops (none / 0) (#105)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:49:04 PM EST
    Passing background checks, but it can be done. I don't think that part of owning one is free either. It has been a long time since I asked about any of that, but I remember that the fees involved in being cleared to own such a weapon are extensive.

    Parent
    I have some direct involvement with Caputo (none / 0) (#78)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 11:15:48 AM EST
    Howdy

    He's not much of an investigative reporter anymore. That is why Armando is fried. He knows Caputo quit his craft.

    Parent

    Proximity to Trump (5.00 / 1) (#86)
    by jondee on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 12:48:55 PM EST
    sucks the soul out of people the way a Black Hole lets no light escape.

    Parent
    This is (none / 0) (#90)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 02:45:43 PM EST
    so true and it's one of the reasons why the soul is being sucked out of our country. Even those of us far far away from this have lost a part of our soul.  I worry about the full on maga and what happens to them at some point with virtually no soul.

    Parent
    Libertarians are just Republicans (none / 0) (#89)
    by jondee on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 02:18:42 PM EST
    who are more fixated on privatization, deregulation, and tax cuts than they are on the unborn and God punishing the sodomites.

    They know that people like certain prominent culture warrior types who will remain nameless, keep the yahoos galvanized and voting 'R', so they tolerate and even celebrate them.

     

    Parent

    This could be bad (none / 0) (#68)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 08:02:20 AM EST

    Between the lines: Federal and state law enforcement officials also are examining leftist groups in Utah to see whether they had knowledge of the alleged shooter's plans beforehand, or if they lent material support to him afterward.

    One of those groups eliminated its social media profile after the shooting, Axios has learned.
    The motive and political ideology of Robinson, 22, are subjects of intense online debate. Some conservatives have insisted he's an unhinged leftist. Liberals have pushed back by pointing to Robinson's conservative upbringing in Utah.



    Parent
    Who on the left isn't terrified (none / 0) (#73)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 09:47:27 AM EST
    Of this administration and MAGA attacking you. Even Jeralyn gets it. Everyone is altering their behavior at the moment. If Tyler had commented on my social media, I probably would have deleted it too.

    Parent
    Most of this current battle ... (none / 0) (#87)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 02:12:26 PM EST
    ... is apparently being waged by people with political agendas over control of the event narrative. It's a duel that doesn't respect nuance, and it's following a script that has reduced both the deceased and his alleged assailant to the respective supporting roles of props in their own storyline.

    The deceased deserved neither his tragic fate as victim of an armed ambush and assault, nor his posthumous and embellished elevation as a glorious martyr for a questionable political faith and even more dubious social cause.

    As for his alleged assailant, he apparently suffered the misfortune of being a colorful three-dimensional figure born into a rigidly two-dimensional household that resides in a black-and-white community with a dim collective view of any misfits amongst them.

    My cousin and her neo-conservative husband - a doctrinaire control freak who was MAGA before there ever was a MAGA movement - relocated to southern Utah in the 1990s, as have thousands of other SoCal expats. They moved first to St. George and then 50 miles north to Cedar City, all to escape that woke liberal latter-day Sodom and Gomorrah otherwise known as metropolitan L.A.

    They did their best to blend in as a Catholic family who had parachuted into the middle of a very Mormon community, but my cousin's three kids definitely failed to fit in and really did not thrive there. All three eventually escaped Cedar City (as two of them termed it) and relocated elsewhere. The youngest moved to Las Vegas (three hours south), the middle child married a college sweetheart from Tacoma, WA and moved there, and the eldest returned to the familiar haunts of L.A. and Pasadena.

    Utah is an absolutely gorgeous state to visit but sociologically and culturally, it is literally its own parallel universe populated by an array of religious iconoclasts, domineering men with deferential wives (an in some cases, sister wives) and archconservative expats who all view the outside world - even the capital of Salt Lake City - as far too freewheeling and unconventional for their liking. And that's the backdrop in which this tragic and tawdry drama is presently playing out.

    Aloha.

    Parent

    I have a special affinity (5.00 / 1) (#97)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:15:11 PM EST
    for rural misfits.  Being one myself.

    Parent
    At least if you go (none / 0) (#99)
    by jondee on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:19:55 PM EST
    full furry, you could trap your own and people wouldn't think too much about it.

    Parent
    Are we talking (none / 0) (#100)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:24:37 PM EST
    about black pills now?

    Parent
    I don't get that reference (none / 0) (#103)
    by jondee on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:43:21 PM EST
    Sorry (none / 0) (#104)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:47:26 PM EST
    You just have to keep up

    Parent
    Here's another very good (none / 0) (#117)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:28:18 PM EST
    Of course (none / 0) (#91)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 02:47:34 PM EST
    but I wouldn't put too much credence into it meaning a whole lot. Remember Trump spent years trying to prove he won the 2020 election and I am sure he is trying to prove that this kid had links to those groups. As far as deleting something, a whole lot of people are doing that these days. Maga has threatened everybody not maga.

    Parent
    Nice thought (none / 0) (#106)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:52:36 PM EST
    but he doesn't need to prove it.  He just needs to say it.

    Parent
    My God (none / 0) (#84)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 12:39:29 PM EST
    You'd think they would want to get rid of us.

    There is a bill in Congress right now that would allow the State Department to revoke the passports of American citizens that criticize U.S. foreign policy.

    Even they (5.00 / 1) (#92)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 02:51:01 PM EST
    know the USA is a miserable place right now and want to force people to stay here instead of being an expat in Italy or Mexico.

    Parent
    PS (none / 0) (#96)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:10:08 PM EST
    for the record I am not pleased I was correct about the trans partner.  I wasn't lying when I said I hope I'm still ng.  I have no idea what it means for the trans community.   Probably nothing good.

    OTOH if they can make it seem this person helped catch the shooter maybe it can help take the target off their back.

    Cause there is going to be SUCH a target on his back.


    One thing (none / 0) (#101)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:25:56 PM EST
    I will say is we all seem to be falling for the thought that being trans is only a left wing thing myself included when there are many right wing trans and gay conservatives. I mean grindr went down during the GOP convention. The main difference seems to be out of the closet or in the closet. I just heard the other day about a thing called lavender marriage. I mean I knew such a thing existed just not that there was a name for it.

    I have seen people online who claim to be attorneys say Patel's behavior and the behavior of others will be used by defense attorneys. There is a reason in all the other previous serious FBIs and DOJs they always were very sparse with their on the record comments.

    Parent

    Actually (none / 0) (#102)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 03:34:57 PM EST
    I never thought trans was a left wing thing.

    but I saw Normal back when it came out.

    Parent

    That was glib (none / 0) (#113)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:20:22 PM EST
    but true.  Also this was at a very formidable time in my life. I thought Switched On Bach was the greatest thing ever.  Before and after.  

    Prior to a live performance of excerpts from the album with the St. Louis Symphony Orchestra, Carlos was apprehensive about appearing in public. She put on fake sideburns and a man's wig, and drew on facial hair with an eyebrow pencil to appear more masculine. She did the same thing again when she met Kubrick, and for an appearance on The Dick Cavett Show in 1970.[34]

    Finally, the commercial success of Switched-On Bach allowed Carlos the funds to undergo feminizing surgery in May 1972



    Parent
    I think I meant formative (none / 0) (#118)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:31:20 PM EST
    ....a very formative time in my life.

    Parent
    In my non legal opinion (none / 0) (#109)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:00:19 PM EST
    they should be used.  Patel is a clown and a danger to the country.  It would be fitting if his incompetence with got him fired.

    But I don't think it will help Robinson.  He is on suicide watch.  He might not make it to trial.

    Parent

    Did not know (none / 0) (#116)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:26:46 PM EST
    about suicide watch. Reuters is reporting that he is not talking.

    Parent
    A nihilist would consider (none / 0) (#120)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:39:09 PM EST
    Suicide over turning himself in and facing  consequences. Tyler told his father he would rather commit suicide than turn himself in. His father motivated him to turn himself in instead. But that is where the suicide concern came from.

    Parent
    He could be Epsteined (none / 0) (#121)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:39:57 PM EST

    Following the assassination of conservative activist Charlie Kirk, the suspect, Tyler Robinson, was placed on suicide watch in a Special Housing Unit of the Utah County Jail.

    The move came after reports that Robinson had told his father he would rather die than be captured.

    Some sources are speculating about whether this is a genuine suicide risk or a strategy to prevent him from revealing more information.



    Parent
    I sure hope not (none / 0) (#122)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:50:33 PM EST
    But considering things that some folks in power in the past have pulled to alter narratives and silence people, I can't assume he's going to be okay. When stone cold sober Hunter Biden told Channel 5 that no one (in his circles) believes Epstein killed himself - that was a holy spit for me. I'm not big on conspiracies but it seems like we are in a bad lawless sinister time line.

    Parent
    This is just becoming too strange (5.00 / 1) (#124)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 06:23:48 PM EST
    "they" might decide a long public trial about trans Furries is not in their interest

    Parent
    Jim Acosta (5.00 / 1) (#126)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 06:51:23 PM EST
    said the same thing about this being strange. He said that the Trump administration found out something and largely went silent.

    Parent
    Ha (none / 0) (#127)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 07:01:13 PM EST
    What are the odds "something" was trans Furries

    Parent
    Yeah (none / 0) (#128)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 07:05:16 PM EST
    I doubt it is that for sure. LOL. Maybe it's Epstein and they are just too preoccupied to worry about this.

    Parent
    Really tho (none / 0) (#131)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 07:17:24 PM EST
    Can you imagine Trump talking about this?  I think he would almost rather talk about Epstein.

    Parent
    I don't believe for a second (none / 0) (#123)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 06:19:28 PM EST
    Epstein killed himself.  Said so right here many times.

    And he was a billionaire celebrity.

     

    Parent

    Dude, there is now rumors (none / 0) (#119)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:36:14 PM EST
    That Tyler has been living at home for the past 6 Mos because roommate thought he might try trans. Did you read the NYTimes article about Tyler signing onto his Discord and his friends noticed that the shooter resembled him and he totally Groypered them? He made sarcastic double meaning remarks to the point that after he was arrested one of his Discord group said they don't know what's real and what's not concerning the incident.

    Parent
    We (none / 0) (#129)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 07:07:06 PM EST
    are never going to get good information it seems. It's like nobody is talking. His family is maga and do they know what "leftist ideology" even is?

    Parent
    I think his parents realize now (none / 0) (#133)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 09:22:59 PM EST
    That his home structure + dark corners of the right-wing internet have very likely destroyed their son's life. Combine some of that with your kid murdered Charlie Kirk, life isn't looking great for any of them.

    I read recently a piece about the Pennsylvania shooter's parents. The mother quit her job stating clearly it was due to ramifications of what her son did. The neighbors have not seen the parents since it happened. It is surmised they only come out of the house at night to set their trash out and collect their mail, but no one has actually witnessed them doing it. I can't imagine the suffering a family is going to experience after this. Life how they knew it is over. I wonder if they are going to lose the permit to own the "ma duece"?

    Guns seem so important to them, losing the right to own one because of this is a rebuke.

    Parent

    'Leftist ideology' is a right-wing trope. (none / 0) (#135)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Mon Sep 15, 2025 at 01:20:09 AM EST
    It means whatever Fox News and Joe Rogan say it means. Speaking of which, there was this woman on Fox News the other day, Rachel Duffy (one of that network's few non-blondes), who just blathered out of her a$$:

    "You heard the family members say that this young man became more political in recent years. But what did he do in recent years? He went to college. That is where kids are getting radicalized. Not just online, our campuses are where a lot of radicalization, hate, and intolerance starts from. So, when he says it's an attack on all of us, I'll just say this: No, it was an attack on conservatives, it was an attack on Christians."

    For the record, Tyler Robinson was radicalized at St. George, UT's notorious hotbed of Marxist extremism and Leninist sedition, Dixie Technical College, where he was studying to attain his certification as an electrician - and, if Ms. Duffy is correct, apparently also minored in Maoist socio-political theory.

    This is just lunacy. How did these people come to be so effin stupid? And why are they always gravitating to Fox News, like insects to a bug lamp?

    :-(

    Parent

    I believe he dropped out (none / 0) (#136)
    by jondee on Mon Sep 15, 2025 at 02:32:43 AM EST
    after one semester.

    Why didn't Rachel mention that? Because she knows loyal Fox viewers mainly care about have their feelings,fears and prejudices stirred-up and validated and exercising any critical thinking gets in the way of that.

    The idea is to make sure the proles don't get any hifalutin radical ideas in their heads.

    Parent

    I think I might have covid (none / 0) (#107)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 04:04:46 PM EST
    feel crappy, temp, coughed all night.

    I will go to the doc tomorrow if I live that long,

    I was vaccinated on the day after my sore throat started last week.

    Ask yur doc about Paxlovid (5.00 / 1) (#108)
    by Peter G on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 04:59:40 PM EST
    as soon as you can

    Parent
    I think it's (none / 0) (#110)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:01:30 PM EST
    Too late.  By tomorrow.  But I will.

    Parent
    Doc (none / 0) (#115)
    by Ga6thDem on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:23:53 PM EST
    told me 48 hours from onset of symptoms but that was almost 3 years ago.

    I hope you feel better soon. I need to get the shot. I have not gotten one in a couple of years.

    Parent

    I'm not sick enough (none / 0) (#111)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:04:27 PM EST
    for the emergency room.  It's day four since symptoms.

    Parent
    You probably won't do it (5.00 / 2) (#112)
    by jondee on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 05:11:11 PM EST
    but super strong ginger tea with lemon and honey always helps me when I have anything respiratory related. Use fresh ginger, bring it to a boil and then simmer it for 20-25 minutes or so.

    Obviously you should still see a doc if nothing improves.

    Parent

    I'm trying not to "karen" you (none / 0) (#134)
    by Militarytracy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 09:36:35 PM EST
    But I'm failing. I'd really rather you get paxlovid every time you know you have Covid Howdy. The accumulating research about Covid infections is not swell. Even mild cases can do long term damage to your body and brain.

    Long Covid researchers are predicting that we are really hurting kids by not properly sanitizing the air in their schools. We have set them up for infection after infection after infection. The damage is accumulative. And children are developing long Covid. But everyone is running around acting oblivious and no one is addressing indoor air quality and cleaning and ventilation. Experts are saying we could be tackling all this but we just don't want to and there will be a price to pay in the end.

    Parent

    Have him test for RSV. (5.00 / 1) (#125)
    by Donald from Hawaii on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 06:46:22 PM EST
    I had that at the beginning of last year, and it walloped the bejesus out of me, like it apparently does to most everyone over 60. It most affects young children, but there's been a sharp uptick in older adults recently. It took me the better part of three months before I began feeling like my old self again. There's a vaccine for it that older adults should get, if you haven't already. It was the one thing I wasn't vaccinated against. I wound up catching it from my 4-year-old grandson.

    Parent
    When I got the vac (none / 0) (#132)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 07:49:10 PM EST
    he mentioned it.  If I got it right it's recommended (free) for 75 and over.

    A couple more years for me.  Unless I got it early :(

    Parent

    Entertainment! (none / 0) (#130)
    by CaptHowdy on Sun Sep 14, 2025 at 07:10:26 PM EST
    If you liked the original 1979 Alien movie you should be watching the series on FX.  On HULU with no commercials.  It is exceptional in every way.  I even love the METAL.  Not everyone likes the soundtrack.  But it's very 1979.

    It will be nominated for everything.  It is prestige tv. And it is in every way an homage to the original movie

    Which some people seem to have forgotten was a HORROR movie.

    They even make the 1979 electronics work.